LM still distillate really hot

tarz

Hi!
Are there (and if so why) any requirements scientifically that the distillate coming out the still should be really cool (ideally as cool as the cooling water)?
Background info
I have a LM style still. (roughly the one featured here  
Idea is that the vapour rises through the column, hits the precondenser at the top and then I have a needle valve to controll the output rate. The output goes to a small condenser and then into the collecting jar(glass).
However I notice that since the small condenser I have is really weak then the output is really hot (~50C). But does this really matter?
PS! No steam coming out of the small condenser, it´s just hot

SDEngr1

I have been told by experienced distillers that a distillate take off temp of 68 F (20 C) is ideal. It allows some of the more volatile/harmful compounds to vaporize off.

LWTCS

Well, your conventional alcometer is typically calibrated for 60 degrees F.
Cant get a real time measurement with warm/hot distillate.
Maybe not an issue for folks that are satisfied with the "it is what it is" approach.Trample the injured and hurdle the dead.

StillerBoy

Lots of missing information, such as water flow rate, your water temp, stripping run or spirit rum, power used, etc..
Your water temp in an LM has a great influence on how the setup works overall..  and the water flow line should be setup differently depending on what mode the unit is operated in..
My LM (concentric) operational numbers are as such..  water inlet temp is 55*F, in stripping mode(using 3000w of power) the distillate at the spout is 85*F, and in spirit mode the distillate at the spout is 60*F..
Mars" I know quite certainly that I myself have no special talent. Curiosity, Obsession and dogged endurance, combined with self-criticism, have brought me to my knowledge and understanding "
– Albert Einstein

tarz

Lots of missing information, such as water flow rate, your water temp, stripping run or spirit rum, power used, etc..
Mars
Respectfully what does it matter? The question was about the effect of the temperature on the distillate itself.
Are there any requirements scientifically that the distillate coming out the still should be really cool.
I totaly understand LWTCS´s point of not being able to read realtime the actual %, however with a temperature correction equation one could make up for that.

Salt-Must-Flow

Hot ethanol evaporates faster than cool ethanol. I would consider hot distillate to be a problem that needs solved. Other than that and what has already been mentioned, it's not going to harm the product.

LWTCS

I do remember reading some posts back in the day that some of the old timers liked to collect it a bit warm to help allow some of the most volatile compounds to air off. Indoors this could very well be a safety issue.
No issues when working in her outdoors. That is unless you view that airing as actual product escaping?
Heck, I just figured the old guys were rationalizing not having a cooling system that was worth a damn

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image.png (345 Bytes) Viewed 132 timesEDIT: Posted the same time as SMFTrample the injured and hurdle the dead.

bunny

I say it doesn't matter.
I don't need to measure my ABV right now.
Tomorrow is soon enough.
I collect the drops directly off the bottom of my valve into a 1.5l wine bottle.

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This becomes easier when you understand your water's characteristics.

StillerBoy

You seem to misunderstand distillation all together..  
If, as you stated, have a similar unit as operated in the video, then I would recommend doing some reading/research on how distillation does work..  distillation is not done by temperature but by flow rate or take off rate..
As already stated by other, hot distillate will evaporate much quicker than cool distillate..  does it effect the distillate itself, never experimented (waste of time) to determine what is lost..
But if you want the distillate to be cooler at the output (spout), especially at the slow rate of take off observed in the video, route your water lines properly..  the inlet line (cold water) should be routed first to the PC (product condenser) then out the top of the PC on to the inlet into the RC (reflux condenser) and the outlet to the drain..
One one other point, if as you stated, have a similar setup, please remove the plastic hose in the outlet line of the hot distillate..
Mars" I know quite certainly that I myself have no special talent. Curiosity, Obsession and dogged endurance, combined with self-criticism, have brought me to my knowledge and understanding "
– Albert Einstein

bunny

For me,""it is what it is"" because I know what it is. It's the same each and every run.
After taking off 1500ml of fores/heads @ 200ml/hr, vapor speed under 20ips, from 28lof 40%ABV charge,I know I'm taking off at azeo.
My bottles all measure 97%ABV at 60*f the next day. The fores seem to measure a squeak higher due to lighter components.This becomes easier when you understand your water's characteristics.

tarz

The goal is not to run the still using temperature, never have I said that nor indicated it. I´m operating the still using flow rate and reflux ratio.
The water lines are routed exactly like that already.
I understand that hot temperature will make it evaporate quicker but since the ambient temperature is significantly lower than the distillate coming out then the distillate should also cool down relatively quickly once in the collection jar. I´d reckon the evaporated alchol lost is negligible in terms of volume. Thank you for the input!

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Yes I do acknowledge that it´s a problem that needs fixing, namely by upgrading the product condenser but as I understand it doesn´t have any other negative effects. Thank you for the reply!


Could even work for my benefit then but still something I wouldn´t want in the long run. Thank you for the reply!


Also thanks, Bunny for the input!

StillerBoy

If your water lines "were routed" as you state, then there no chance that the distillate is as hot as you have stated, especially operating an LM in the spirit mode..  unless the water used is hot to start with..
But since you are so adamant that it's not a water flow issue, sorry for having confused you with providing info on how to operate an LM..
Mars" I know quite certainly that I myself have no special talent. Curiosity, Obsession and dogged endurance, combined with self-criticism, have brought me to my knowledge and understanding "
– Albert Einstein