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Single reflux run tffv

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Post time 2022-12-16 17:30:13 | Show all posts |Read mode
Hi chaps
It's getting close to Xmas. I have 160l of tffv, always done me well in the past. Historically I have always done stripping  runs then spirit run but I'm not sure I'm going to get the time before the big day, would it be reasonable to do a low and slow single run with 5 bubble plates and dephleg with some packing (little bits of copper pipe)
I have no doubt it won't be as clean but I'm planning on using it for flavoured vodkas ie apple pie, limoncello etc. Any thoughts?
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Post time 2022-12-16 21:20:51 | Show all posts
Thats a big boiler full and exceeds our rules if you were to do it all in one run.
If nothing else you’d be better to at least strip half it and add it to the remaining wash if you can’t find time to strip it all first .
Or if you just need some quick for xmas , just process say 1/3 of it but do it properly and finish the rest when you have time . I’ve done that many times when we’ve run out and someone is stomping their footMy recommended goto .
https://homedistiller.org/wiki/index.ph ... ion_Theory
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Post time 2022-12-16 21:54:21 | Show all posts
+1 with Yummy, I was going to suggest the same

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Post time 2022-12-17 01:47:30 | Show all posts
Ive run Shadys S,S through 4 plates when I was in a hurry once and had no other option and needed a base spirit for gin in a hurry. I did Strip first however.....and only kept the heart of hearts on the strip run.....it was surprisingly good and made a nice enough gin.
I cant see why the same wont work using TFFV.
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Post time 2022-12-17 06:26:26 | Show all posts
TFFV has a heap of bran in it which Shady's doesn't.  Unless you are a fan of the flavor, you might be disappointed.
Consider taking a very narrow heart cut for your current needs and dealing with the feints later.
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 Author| Post time 2022-12-17 10:37:39 | Show all posts
Thats all great Info. I have a 50l keg so would be at least 4 strips. Maybe I could do 2 back to back and mix with remaining wash for spirit run. Food for thought, thanks fellas.
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Post time 2022-12-18 12:01:43 | Show all posts
Sonofodin,
I can give you some more food for thought.
I used my pot still and plate column calculators to compare Strip and Spirit Runs vs One and Done Runs for your 160 L of tffv wash. It looks like you have a 5 plate 3" bubble cap reflux column with a 2" dephleg and a 50 L boiler. I will use a 10% wash in the boiler. You have 2 x 2000 watt heater, I will say you can control the heat load. Please correct these numbers if I estimated wrong. I can redo the work.  
Strip and Spirit Runs
First lets strip a 40L 10% abv wash charge at 4000 watts. Here are my Haggy Pot Thumper HD Calculator results, but only consider the pot results. They are on the left side of the Table. I added some riser added reflux to the pot to increase the abv some. First the Input Data, then the Table of Results.
Strip Run

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It takes about 42 minutes to heat the pot up to the start of boiling. Time starts in the Table when the pot starts boiling. In the Table you see that at 85 minutes after the pot starts boiling, the pot vapor abv is down to 10%, and cumulative product out of the pot is 10L at 41% abv. But if we throw out the fores and early heads, we get about 9 L at 40% abv. We will do two strip runs, so we have 18 L at 40% abv. Each strip run takes about 130+ minutes so total strip time is about 4.5  hours.

Then combine the 18 L of 40% abv with the 62 L of 10% wash and get 80 L at 16.8% abv. Run this in 2 spirit runs and get the following results using my Plate Reflux Column Characteristics Calculator.  I estimate that 2000 watts is the maximum heat the bubble column can run before it sees flooding. My calculator is for four plates while you have five plates plus some packing.
Spirit Run

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It takes about 6.1 hours for one spirit run, so two spirit runs would be 12.5 hours.  So the total run time for this option ( strip + spirit ) is about  17 hours. About 10.2 L at 94+% abv is the total hearts product made. I added 1% abv for your fifth plate.

One and Done Runs
These runs will use 40 L of a 10% abv wash in the pot. Since we are at 10% abv, the pot heating watts can be higher, use 3000 watts, again close to the flooding point. Here is the Input Data and Results of one run. Four runs are needed for the 160 L of wash.

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About 3.34 L of Hearts are made at about 93% abv in each run at a run time about 4.5 hours. Four runs are made, so the total run time for this One and Done option is about 18 hours. About 13.3 L at 94% abv is the total product made. I added 1% for your fifth plate.
Final Summary
Two Strip runs  and Two Spirit Runs-------------17 hours run time ------------10.2 L at 94+% abv
Four One and Done Runs-------------------------18 hours run time-------------13.3 L at 94% abv     
Both options seem viable. The One and Done run might take slightly more time but makes more product. The Strip and Spirit runs will make a slightly higher % abv. They both have four total runs so set up time is about the same. The One and Done run uses all the wash, the Strip and Spirit has 18 L of wash remaining. Again, my plate reflux calculators only have four plates maximum. Your five plate column plus some packing may get slightly higher product abv, close to 94+%.

You were planning to do one of these two options. I have put some pretty good estimated numbers on them to help your planning and to show what can be done using the calculators.
haggy
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 Author| Post time 2022-12-18 13:22:59 | Show all posts
Haggy! What can I say, a true gentleman! (I am assuming!) Or lady gentleman! Really appreciate the time you have taken to set all this out for me, above and beyond my friend. I will have a good study today. I am currently running  a strip in -3 celcius in my garage! Seems to be helping out the condenser a bit but without insulation round the column I guess it all equals out! Thanks again.
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Post time 2022-12-18 14:37:39 | Show all posts
Have never messed with Teddys Vodka but I’ve done a couple single runs of Shady’s Shine through a 4 plater. I use perf plates. I think the results were great for mixed drinks and “Apple Pie”. Definitely NOT neutral but given time (which you don’t have at the moment) the distillate lost a bit of flavor. Probably from opening and closing the jug.Freedom had been hunted round the globe; reason was considered as rebellion; and the slavery of fear had made men afraid to think. But such is the irresistible nature of truth, that all it asks, and all it wants, is the liberty of appearing.
-Thomas Paine
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 Author| Post time 2022-12-19 19:19:52 | Show all posts
Cheers stonecutter. Good to know! Maybe a single run and a good filter? To be fair I've been burning the candle with strips. It's only the pressure I put on myself to drink decent liquor for Xmas but worst case there's always shop bought.....eew!
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 Author| Post time 2022-12-23 13:50:25 | Show all posts
Well in the end got 4 strips done and spirit run is coming out at 94% tastes great off the spout. Has been a hard slog on top of work this week but going to be worth it!
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